[USCC] What is anaerobic composting?

Dan Noble dan at resourcetrends.com
Fri Feb 13 12:23:26 CST 2009 

Hi Jeff,

No, I don't believe the folks claiming benefiting from anaerobic composting 
are just giving up, rather they're using it in an engineered process... and 
I agree, it may be a "misnomer", but the terms are already out there, 
attempting to describe an actual, bona fide organics treatment train.  Like 
in the case of Kompogas.com, it's a two stage process.  The first stage 
(anaerobic composting) is not a "mistake", but rather is in a closed 
container, but in a wet pile (sometimes rotated/mixed), but the methane that 
is produced is captured and either stored and piped, or cleaned and used to 
produce electricity in gas turbines onsite (just like "normal" anaerobic 
digestion (AD)).  The digestate (what's left over from the anaerobic phase) 
is then composted "normally" in an aerobic phase, typically mixed with an 
additional carbon source (bulking agent), I believe.  So that's about all I 
know... you've exhausted my meager knowledge on the subject.

As you and others on this email list have pointed out... it may be a 
misnomer (i.e. simply "bad composting"... since, by definition, composting 
IS, or should be(!), an aerobic process.  Maybe it would be better called 
"less wet AD" or "dry AD" or some such.  Of course it's not really "dry" 
since I believe it's still about 20-30% solids... compared to typical single 
stage AD which is about 5-10% solids/water, right?  But the physical state 
is not so much a slurry, like normal AD, but more like a very wet compost 
pile, I believe (particle size obviously factors into this.  Imagine food 
and green waste together, where you have more food waste (wet, more 
nitrogen) than green waste (dryer more carbon).  Whereas aerobic composting 
is between more or less about 50%, right?  But again, it would be better for 
someone else who really understands this more than me to chime in and 
explain this further... now's a chance!

My only purpose for piping up was to point out that these technologies ARE 
being used successfully for years in Europe and are now starting to come to 
the US.  For me, the idea of getting BOTH energy AND composted soil 
amendments is very interesting and I believe that our US Composting industry 
should at least stay open to the idea and, better, investigate it further. 
Maybe some of you have seen presentations by these companies (I saw them at 
our local/annual PORS, Pacific-southwest Organics Residuals Symposium a 
couple of years ago). So rather than dismiss it as not "real" or "quality" 
composting, my belief is that we need to understand the important interface 
between anerobic and aerobic processes in both our slurries as well as piles 
and then determine (via total/local life cycle analysis) which processes and 
markets are best for our "net environmental/financial benefits" in our local 
communities.

Sincerely,
Dan

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jeff Ziegenbein" <jziegenb at ieua.org>
To: "'Compost Discussion List'" <compost at mailman.cloudnet.com>
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: [USCC] What is anaerobic composting?


> Anaerobic composting is what most of us try to avoid. We spend energy and 
> resources turning and/or aerating to keep our piles from turning anaerobic 
> is much as possible. Maybe the folks claiming to benefit from it are just 
> giving up.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: compost-bounces at mailman.cloudnet.com 
> [mailto:compost-bounces at mailman.cloudnet.com] On Behalf Of Dan Noble
> Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 5:37 PM
> To: Compost Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [USCC] What is anaerobic composting?
>
> Too late!  It's already in the industrial lexicon, like the word 
> "organic".
> Again... Google it and see all the papers.
> Dan, ACP, www.healthsoil.org
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Donald Lewis" <LewisDV at mda.state.md.us>
> To: "'Compost Discussion List'" <compost at mailman.cloudnet.com>
> Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 11:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [USCC] What is anaerobic composting?
>
>
>>I would ask this list whether anaerobic and compost are even compatible
>>words. Engineers usually use the term "Anaerobic Composting" to mean
>>"Anaerobic digestion". The term "anaerobic digestion" can then be reserved
>>for sewage, which everyone knows is bad. The problem with what is called
>>"anaerobic composting" is that anaerobic processes stink and produce a
>>product with very low pH, and containing phytotoxic chemicals.
>>
>> What the engineer was trying to describe is a product that is decomposed
>> in the absence of air. Currently, there is a process that has drawn a 
>> fair
>> amount of attention that involves anaerobic digestion with the collection
>> of methane to be used as a fuel, followed by mixing with a bulking agent
>> like wood chips and aerobic composting. This process can result in an
>> acceptable product if the odor problems at the beginning of the 
>> composting
>> process can be dealt with.
>>
>> Don Lewis
>> Compost Coordinator
>> Maryland Department of Agriculture
>> 50 Harry S. Truman Parkway
>> Annapolis, MD 21401
>> Tel. # 410-841-2721
>>
>>>>> "Myron Hirschman" <hirschsys at aol.com> 2/12/2009 12:23 PM >>>
>> I was recently in a meeting discussing composting options for the
>> community.
>> Their engineer mentioned anaerobic composting as a system.  I didn't have
>> the opportunity to get that explained to me. I am guessing he meant
>> systems
>> that didn't have forced aeration ( if that is what he meant I disagree
>> with
>> his use of the terms).
>>
>> Please educate me.
>> What is anaerobic composting?
>>
>> Thanks
>> Myron H
>> myron at hirschsystems.com
>>
>> _______________________________________
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>> Join us as the US Composting Council's 18th Annual Conference & Trade
>> Show, January 24-27, 2010 at the Wyndham Orlando Resort, FL. The Largest
>> Conference & Exhibition in North America for the Composting, Wood Waste, 
>> &
>> Organics Recycling Industry. The Most Comprehensive Program of Training
>> Courses, Educational & Technical Presentations, and Facility Tours &
>> "Live" Equipment Demonstrations at the Disney/Reedy Creek Composting
>> Facility. Conference Highlights & Program, Registration forms, Exhibitor
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>> This list is a service provided by the US Composting Council (USCC).
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>> Opinions expressed do not necessarily represent the USCC, the Foundation,
>> or the Board of Directors.
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>
>
> _______________________________________
> Join us as the US Composting Council's 18th Annual Conference & Trade 
> Show, January 24-27, 2010 at the Wyndham Orlando Resort, FL. The Largest 
> Conference & Exhibition in North America for the Composting, Wood Waste, & 
> Organics Recycling Industry. The Most Comprehensive Program of Training 
> Courses, Educational & Technical Presentations, and Facility Tours & 
> "Live" Equipment Demonstrations at the Disney/Reedy Creek Composting 
> Facility. Conference Highlights & Program, Registration forms, Exhibitor 
> Information and Sponsorship Opportunities available at the USCC website 
> www.compostingcouncil.org or call the USCC at 631.737.4931
> _____________________________________________________________________________
> Compost maillist - compost at mailman.cloudnet.com
> http://mailman.cloudnet.com/mailman/listinfo/compost
> _______________________________________
> This list is a service provided by the US Composting Council (USCC).
> (c) Copyright 2004 United States Composting Council - All rights reserved
>
> Opinions expressed do not necessarily represent the USCC, the Foundation, 
> or the Board of Directors.
>
> Non-members of USCC are encouraged to join the Council through its website 
> at: http://www.compostingcouncil.org/membership.cfm
>
> Members posting CC copies to the list and other addresses may have their 
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>
> For additional help in unsubcribing or to report bugs and problems, send a 
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> _______________________________________
> Join us as the US Composting Council's 18th Annual Conference & Trade 
> Show, January 24-27, 2010 at the Wyndham Orlando Resort, FL. The Largest 
> Conference & Exhibition in North America for the Composting, Wood Waste, & 
> Organics Recycling Industry. The Most Comprehensive Program of Training 
> Courses, Educational & Technical Presentations, and Facility Tours & 
> "Live" Equipment Demonstrations at the Disney/Reedy Creek Composting 
> Facility. Conference Highlights & Program, Registration forms, Exhibitor 
> Information and Sponsorship Opportunities available at the USCC website 
> www.compostingcouncil.org or call the USCC at 631.737.4931
> _____________________________________________________________________________
> Compost maillist - compost at mailman.cloudnet.com
> http://mailman.cloudnet.com/mailman/listinfo/compost
> _______________________________________
> This list is a service provided by the US Composting Council (USCC).
> (c) Copyright 2004 United States Composting Council - All rights reserved
>
> Opinions expressed do not necessarily represent the USCC, the Foundation, 
> or the Board of Directors.
>
> Non-members of USCC are encouraged to join the Council through its website 
> at: http://www.compostingcouncil.org/membership.cfm
>
> Members posting CC copies to the list and other addresses may have their 
> posting privileges suspended. For discussion list policies and information 
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>
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>

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